Animation Source Forums

*EDIT* Poll has been removed due to inaccuracies. If you had voted and had NOT commented, please do so to explain your opinion. We need them to understand everyone's views.



This topic is one brought up several times, so I thought I would create a quick poll and get everyone's opinion. This doesn't necessarily mean it will be the official outcome, but it will definitely help us mods come up with some details to give for this issue if we need to make a rule.

Currently we have been thinking to have adoptables images be allowed ONLY if properly source related (e.g: related to well source related characters), well made (e.g: not just plain Balto, Kodi, or Aleu marking clones), and maybe but a limit to how many can be in a gallery (active). Any thing else will have to be posted in the adoptables section of the forums. Of course the no sparkle dogs/wolves/lions/etc would also still apply to both site and forum.

Please comment and discuss below. But please note: Any fighting/instigating will not be tolerated. If you cannot be mature about this topic you can and will be warned/banned as needed. We will delete any inappropriate or unrelated comments from this topic without warning also, if needed. So please keep to the subject. Any message unrelated to the topic aimed at other member should be sent through PMs.

I'll put in my two cents, which I think is logical, but some people will probably disagree with me.

I don't see why adoptables should be on the source sites at all. I personally think they should just stay on the forums. This didn't used to be a problem and things went just as smoothly a few years ago when adoptables were, more or less, strictly on the forums. Here are my points of argument:

1. I don't know this for a fact, but from my point of view, I only noticed a large number of adoptables on image galleries when the Adoption forums got stricter rules and no longer allowed "puppy mill" or "random designs" adoptions. As soon as these rules were put into place, adoptables started popping up in image galleries, normally of the same line-art colored in various (almost always common) designs. Then, the whole issue with sparkle dogs started to come into play as well, and while the Adoption forums had fewer topics that held decent adoptions, image galleries were over-run with purple and blue puppies looking for a home. While the forums did have this issue years ago, before the rule change, it seems to me that the problem was just moved to the site while the forums grew into decent adoptions.

2. It is just plain confusing to have adoptables in two separate places. If I was looking to adopt a new character, I would not only have to check out the forum topics, but I would also have to browse through tons of galleries. Which leads me to my next point...

3. Image gallery adoptions are just plain confusing. First off, a member has to look through many galleries just to find an adoptable image they might have an interest in, and then they must read through all the comments to see which pups are still available. While most image gallery 'artists' will remedy this by keeping a nice list in the image description, it still looks disorganized and it is hard for the member holding the adoption to keep track of all the comments. A forum topic is so much more organized. The creator of the topic can easily keep track of the posts and can quickly make changes to the first post to keep things nice and neat.

4. Writing a full Adoption Form Bio in the comments of a gallery is not any easy thing to do. There is a word limit, which discourages thought out histories and personalities that have some length to them. Also, if a member were to split the bio into two comments, the bio will be backwards because of how the comments are set up. Meanwhile, the forum gives unlimited room to create an in-depth character. Besides, in Image galleries, a member wanting a pup would have to draw the character, upload the picture to their gallery, and then link it in a comment. On the other hand, it is easy to attach a picture to a forum post. (This is providing that adoptions must have a picture, which is something a personally think an adoption must have, but thats another opinion for another discussion.)

5. Image gallery adoptions are limited to one picture, while on a forum topic, an artist can post multiple pictures of multiple characters, which decreases the occurrence mentioned above about one line-art being colored over in twenty different way.

To sum things up: Image Gallery Adoptables encourage less thought out character biographies and line-art adoptions while Forum Adoptables encourage detailed biographies and characters which are drawn or well rendered.

In other words, cleaning up these bad adoptions could, in effect, help clean up the character pages... Just saying...

Pretty much what Rose said.

But I wanted to point out something.

"Related and well made to be on-site, anything else sent to forums"

If I understand this correctly, this means that any random characters are to be sent to the forums. If so, this isn't doing anything but taking it from the site to the forums, so the problem still exists.

Thanking for pointing out the one thing I forgot to mention that is probably the most important and the point that disturbed me the most. (If that is the right word). I can't believe, so far, that option in the poll has the most votes, at this time. Where is the common sense, people? Honestly, mods, don't go with this. Please. I am personally begging you. The adoption forums are a wonderful place with rule abiding topics and character adoptions that are not just random designs that are pups of two poorly created characters or random distant relatives of some other poorly made characters, which will just be made into even more poorly made characters and continue the over growing problem in the fan character sections.

Hmm, hope you can follow that train of thought.... makes sense to me. *shrugs*

Anyways, I don't understand this at all. If an adoption is unrelated and poorly made, can't we just say no and not allow it on the site AT ALL? Am I talking crazy here? Because, to me, ONLY related and well-made adoptions should be allowed ANYWHERE, and the Mods really need to be less leniate on what is allowed on AS. Ignore the whining and complaining and put a foot down. Demand members, yes even new ones, to put some effort in their work. I was a noob when the rules were actually enforced, and I came out just fine. My creativity wasn't squashed; my feelings weren't hurt. I learned to comply to rules and not throw a tantrum whenever things didn't go my way. Did I get made at the mods when my unrelated characters were not activated? Yes. Was I upset when I had to stop my adoption thread of random designs? Yes. Did I run to the shout box or news articles or members' profiles and complain in all caps? No, because that wasn't tolerated back then, and I probably would have gotten banned.

Wow. That got rant-y really fast. Whoops... I apparently have got a lot of feelings I've been keeping cooped up.

If (note the IF) we did go with allowing non-related adoptables on the forums, we would of course limit it and have certain rules so it's not spamming up the section. It wouldn't be a free for all.

I don't think that would really be fair. If it's to be limited, then the rest should be banned as well. Because I just have that feeling if you mods were to go with this choice, the rules would not be enforced because I hardly ever see any mods on the forums. And if the rules are not being enforced, like little kids that are not being watched, a free for all will begin.

There is also the fact that random characters are against the rules on that board.

I just don't see the point in having non-related adoptables at all considering that only related characters can be (should be) allowed on the site. There's enough unrelated content as is. Why should unrelated adoptable be allowed at all? And what sort of limits would there be? The rules on the forums are working well, so I don't see the need to change them too drastically.



On a slightly unrelated note (bear with me), I've already seen this happen on with The Lady And The Tramp roleplaying section. Noobs and kids didn't like the no one-line posts on the general and balto forums because the older members reported rule breaking, so they went to this neatly tucked away section of the forums. The results were horrid. My point? If some leniency is allowed, the noobs and kids will take over the adoption forums. Members can report topic after topic, noobs will whine and rant each time, and Mods can lock and delete topic after topic, but it will cause a lot of annoyance and drama. Besides, with the low number in Mods, watching over another section of the site and making decisions on a case-by-case basis takes even more time away from you guys. Believe me, I am on your side. Stricter rules leads to less grey areas which leads to less case-by-case discussions which gives you Mods less to deal with and more time to deal with everything else. Honestly, don't give yourself more work! You have the opportunity to lessen it with this rule; why not take it?

P.S. Just one more point to add. Right now, the poorly made and unrelated adoptable are on the site and the well made and related adoptables are on the forums. What will switching that around accomplish?

I'm all for keeping adoptables to the forums.
Basically I agree wholeheartedly with Black Rose. It gets too confusing when people just put random adoptables in their image galleries. It's not that hard to make a topic in the adoptables, it allows for a lot of text, lots of pictures, it's easy to find entires, etc.
BUT it would be nice if the people that wanted to post adoptables had ONE topic each. Not multiple for each person.

I'm trying to express what I'm thinking here, and it's kind of hard, but I'll do my best...

What I think should be allowed as "adoptables" are:
1. Old Characters that aren't needed anymore
2. Old designs that were posted but never used
3. Litters from Canon x Oc
4. or Litters from Canon x Canon
5. Oc litters related to Canon characters

Then again, there's problems with bad designs/sparkles...and this place could turn into another puppy mill

There is a reason to change it. Why? Because this is a fan site, not a puppy mill. And as for sparkle dogs? When was the last time you ever saw flying zeba striped money in the Balto films? The answer is never. Just because you made it Balto related doesn't cut it. There is no way something that drastic can fit into the Balto universe.

Again, this is a fan site, not a puppy mill. This kind of stuff is better of on Deviant art, not on a fan site.

Tearing Balto Source apart? *WE* are hardly the ones tearing it apart. I don't understand, and I probably never will, how this site suggests that this is a game site for characters.

The old Balto Source? XD The old Balto Source was a time when we had a good staff,a webmaster that cared and no characters section.

This topic is not intended to rouse people to engage in a tense debate about whether or not things should go back to sparkle dogs, unrealistic dogs, unrelenting adoptables, mates, etc.

Let's not push this thing off course, shall we? Hmm?

Well, you don't have to get rid of the characters section, if you'e starting to lean towards that. In my opinion, only people's fursona's should be allowed to be sparkledogs. Anything other than a fursona should be realistic. And as for adoptables, although it is true that this place is turning into a bit of a puppy mill, adoptables shouldn't be banned completely. They should just be created in moderation.

I never suggested that at all. When this site was first created, there never was a characters section, that was all I was saying.

And as for fursonas? I don't see why they should be allowed. Fursonas are a representation of you as an animal. How do you relate to Balto? In order for that to happen, you would have to have been alive and living in Nome during that time.

Adoptables should be allowed, but only good ones. Not something you came up with five minutes ago.

I agree full-heartedly with this list. And, with number 5, they should have a fairly strong relation to Canon characters, not just "lives in Nome" or "saw Kodi and the mail team this one time." (both are things I have seen before) This is more a character issue than an adoptable one, but I think in order to talk about adoptables, characters have to come into consideration.



First off, I don't think anyone suggested no adoptions at all. Just moving them to the forums instead of the galleries.

Second, Sparkle dogs have not always been a part of AS. Not in the least. When I first joined, I had no idea what a sparkle dog even was. Why? Because they weren't allowed on AS. For good reasons, I might mention.

Thirdly, a flying zebra striped monkey? Those don't even exist, so how would anyone make it Balto related without being completely ridiculous and unrealistic. Okay, so you were exaggerating. I get that. But a monkey still would not belong an AS without some really creative thinking and probably historical research. Besides, with the lame excuses for characters being Balto related anyway, the Mods can't simply allow ANY character who is slightly related to Balto.

Fourthly, the people trying to make AS better are making logical sense while those stuck in their ways and (I mean no offense to anyone by this next comment) spoiled beyond belief because any lame character they come up with is accepted, continue to whine and argue immaturely instead of actually thinking about it. Balto Source is a Balto fan-site for Balto related fan creations. If everyone understood the meaning of this, we would not have a problem and this 'war' between old members and new/noob members would not exist.

Fifthly, frankly, you are not an old enough member to remember the old Sources. Back when it was just BS, TLKS, and TSS, things were good. No sparkle dogs, no characters, less drama, and a better sense of community.

Actually, I am with you on bringing back the old AS, we just have very different views on what the good old AS is.



and



Agreed! I really don't mind fursonas, but I don't think they should get a character page because they aren't characters. A fursona is a version of you; you are not a character; therefore, your fursona is not a character. I don't know why people can't (or refuse to) follow this logic.



Very true, but when discussing adoptables, the subject of characters is naturally coming up. Unfortunately, that tends to rally the pro-sparkle members, but hopefully they'll soon realize it's a dead issue and learn to just follow the rules.

EDIT://

I still don't understand why the majority of people are voting for well-made adoptable to stay on the galleries and random stuff go to the forums. I hope it's not because people think the stuff currently on the image galleries is well-made...

^ This.
Adoptables belongs to the Forum and the Forum only. If there is an Adoptables section, why don't people use it? That section had been dead for quite some time. Why? Because that section had basically moved to the galleries.
The new "fashion of the moment" is the Guess the Parents. I think that's pretty much a second name to say Free random Adoptables.
I won't say enything else because I'd keep repeating what had been already said. But one thing I'll say again: adoptables belongs to the Forum.