Is Santa real?

sunkissin · **Posted:** Thu Dec 14, 2006 10:43 am

NightFang wrote:

I believe in Santa, 'ya don't believe 'ya don't receive^^

That's not one bit true. I don't believe, yet I still get presents. My mum and dad ask me for what I want every year.

BaltoSeppala wrote:

Mm...I detect a hint of greed in this statement. I don't think that's what the belief is supposed to be based upon. It's supposed to be based upon the idea that if you have a good heart, and behave in a kind, friendly, and charitable way towards your fellow man, ol' St. Nick will pay you a visit. Of course, believing in him does help.

That being said...

I did as a kid. I don't now. I know that Santa Claus (or Father Christmas, or whatever other version you believe in) is representative of the spirit of Christmas. He is a symbol. And a fantasy presented to children to brighten their hearts at Christmas time, and to encourage them to the behavior I mentioned in the previous paragraph in order to receive gifts from him. At least, that is how it once was. Kids receive gifts on Christmas now no matter what...good or bad. During the Victorian and Edwardian eras, bad kids really did sometimes receive coal in their stockings, or NOTHING.

Anyone happen to notice that "Santa Claus" is a sort of reworking of the words "Saint Nicholas", upon whom he is loosely based? The gift-giving Catholic saint? This probably came about, at first, from verbal mispronunciations of the saint's Dutch name and title ("Sinterklaas"), first by the English settlers of New York (once called "New Amsterdam", because the state was first settled by the Dutch when it was still a colony of that country, before it was sold to the English), and the building of the "jolly old elf" myth around him. Note this link for more info: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Santa_Claus

Without going into too much of a history lesson (which might bore some of you who couldn't care less), the Santa Claus known in America first made his appearance in the January 3rd, 1863 issue of Harper's Weekly magazine, showing him giving gifts to Union soldiers in camp. He's clad differently too...in a blue, starry jacket with red-and-white striped pants, and a red hat with a holly sprig in it (while the copy of the cover page of that issue appears below in sepia tone, and was originally black-and-white, I know the appearance of the clothing, because I've seen historical re-enactors portray him, and I've seen color drawings of it). That was the first appearance of Santa Claus in the U.S. EVER...during the midst of the American Civil War in the 1860s. It was drawn by the famous political cartoonist Thomas Nast, and would later inspire other drawings of him, soon enough in the well-known red and white suit. He appeared this way because, before this first drawing, he had never really been described in any great detail (even in Clement Clarke Moore's 1822 poem "A Visit From St. Nicholas", or "The Night Before Christmas", which he had written ON Christmas Eve that year for his family. It was never even intended to be published or released to the public by Moore. A family friend saw it, copied it in her own album, and then submitted it to the editor of the Troy [New York] Sentinel, where it was first published on December 23rd, 1823. Moore himself didn't even take credit for it until he later published a book of his own poems, in 1844).

Thank you Seppala! ^_^

(deleted user) · **Posted:** Thu Dec 14, 2006 11:34 am

Daisy~DreamerWolf wrote:

NightFang wrote:

I believe in Santa, 'ya don't believe 'ya don't receive^^

That's not one bit true. I don't believe, yet I still get presents. My mum and dad ask me for what I want every year.

BaltoSeppala wrote:

Mm...I detect a hint of greed in this statement. I don't think that's what the belief is supposed to be based upon. It's supposed to be based upon the idea that if you have a good heart, and behave in a kind, friendly, and charitable way towards your fellow man, ol' St. Nick will pay you a visit. Of course, believing in him does help.

That being said...

I did as a kid. I don't now. I know that Santa Claus (or Father Christmas, or whatever other version you believe in) is representative of the spirit of Christmas. He is a symbol. And a fantasy presented to children to brighten their hearts at Christmas time, and to encourage them to the behavior I mentioned in the previous paragraph in order to receive gifts from him. At least, that is how it once was. Kids receive gifts on Christmas now no matter what...good or bad. During the Victorian and Edwardian eras, bad kids really did sometimes receive coal in their stockings, or NOTHING.

Anyone happen to notice that "Santa Claus" is a sort of reworking of the words "Saint Nicholas", upon whom he is loosely based? The gift-giving Catholic saint? This probably came about, at first, from verbal mispronunciations of the saint's Dutch name and title ("Sinterklaas"), first by the English settlers of New York (once called "New Amsterdam", because the state was first settled by the Dutch when it was still a colony of that country, before it was sold to the English), and the building of the "jolly old elf" myth around him. Note this link for more info: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Santa_Claus

Without going into too much of a history lesson (which might bore some of you who couldn't care less), the Santa Claus known in America first made his appearance in the January 3rd, 1863 issue of Harper's Weekly magazine, showing him giving gifts to Union soldiers in camp. He's clad differently too...in a blue, starry jacket with red-and-white striped pants, and a red hat with a holly sprig in it (while the copy of the cover page of that issue appears below in sepia tone, and was originally black-and-white, I know the appearance of the clothing, because I've seen historical re-enactors portray him, and I've seen color drawings of it). That was the first appearance of Santa Claus in the U.S. EVER...during the midst of the American Civil War in the 1860s. It was drawn by the famous political cartoonist Thomas Nast, and would later inspire other drawings of him, soon enough in the well-known red and white suit. He appeared this way because, before this first drawing, he had never really been described in any great detail (even in Clement Clarke Moore's 1822 poem "A Visit From St. Nicholas", or "The Night Before Christmas", which he had written ON Christmas Eve that year for his family. It was never even intended to be published or released to the public by Moore. A family friend saw it, copied it in her own album, and then submitted it to the editor of the Troy [New York] Sentinel, where it was first published on December 23rd, 1823. Moore himself didn't even take credit for it until he later published a book of his own poems, in 1844).

Thank you Seppala! ^_^

Always happy to help educate folks, Daisy. And you're welcome! :wink:

MayaHuskee · **Posted:** Sun Dec 17, 2006 6:26 pm

...Did someone SERIOUSLY start this? I mean.. who the heck still believes Santa is real?... Haven't you ever put TWO and TWO together?...

"ZOMFG MOMMY! I WANT THIS BALTO DVD! 8DDD!!!"... And you see it in the store, correct?... Wellllllllllllllll.. And then maybe you get it for christmas?... I want to see the fat guys at the mall make this DVD and not get sued. =]... XDDD

And.. yeah.. Hes like.. a stalker man. o.0... Hasn't anyone noticed? XD.. He comes down your chimney at night.. and walks around your house... WHILE YOU SLEEP IN YOUR UNDERWEAR!... XDDDD!!! He knows were you live. =].. He can see you when your sleeping... I SAY STALKERRRR!!!...

So yeah... How old are you people again?.. XDD I mean.. seriously. How old?.. I haven't believe in Santa for like... ever. Sense I was like... Six.. or Seven.. Or younger. =]... I put two and two together REALLY fast. XD... I always thought Santa was scary anyways. =].. So yeah..

Thus my opinion. 8D...

--MayaHuskee

Random Bunny · **Posted:** Sun Dec 17, 2006 7:48 pm

-sigh-

Believe what you believe in. Santa is in my heart, and I believe in him in my heart.

He is real for children, and children at heart.. No matter what.

You don't have to believe that he is coming in your house, putting those gifts on the ground, but you can believe in him in your heart. =)

So, enough of this, and just share alittle bit of Christmas joy - K?

sunkissin · **Posted:** Mon Dec 18, 2006 11:58 am

Jack~MayaHuskee wrote:

...Did someone SERIOUSLY start this? I mean.. who the heck still believes Santa is real?... Haven't you ever put TWO and TWO together?...

"ZOMFG MOMMY! I WANT THIS BALTO DVD! 8DDD!!!"... And you see it in the store, correct?... Wellllllllllllllll.. And then maybe you get it for christmas?... I want to see the fat guys at the mall make this DVD and not get sued. =]... XDDD

And.. yeah.. Hes like.. a stalker man. o.0... Hasn't anyone noticed? XD.. He comes down your chimney at night.. and walks around your house... WHILE YOU SLEEP IN YOUR UNDERWEAR!... XDDDD!!! He knows were you live. =].. He can see you when your sleeping... I SAY STALKERRRR!!!...

So yeah... How old are you people again?.. XDD I mean.. seriously. How old?.. I haven't believe in Santa for like... ever. Sense I was like... Six.. or Seven.. Or younger. =]... I put two and two together REALLY fast. XD... I always thought Santa was scary anyways. =].. So yeah..

Thus my opinion. 8D...

--MayaHuskee

Yup, I'm so with you!!!

Seriously....how old are you people??? I mean...the whole thing is absoloutely impossible!!! Flying reindeer?!? WTF?!? And all in one night?!?

Pfft, all impossible. Sure...it's a nice thing to believe...if you're 8 or younger :roll:

My mum and dad ASK me what I would like! Then they get it for me :roll:

All just a scam to keep little children happy. Seriously...HOW OLD ARE YOU PEOPLE?!?!?!?! :shock:

--- DDW

(deleted user) · **Posted:** Mon Dec 18, 2006 2:28 pm

I actually find myself in complete agreement with Balto Wolfdog here. I think it's wrong of you guys to be trashing people for expressing some sort of belief in Santa Claus. Remember that some kids DO visit here, and are younger than ten.

Really, what's the big deal if they say they do? Does it HURT you that they said so? I mean, there are certainly other far more oddball (and really DUMB) things people say on these forums, that can often be worthy of a little jibing. But this?

As Space Ghost once admonished: "Zorak, that's not very Christmas-y." (And then he zapped Zorak.)

MayaHuskee · **Posted:** Mon Dec 18, 2006 4:17 pm

BaltoSeppala wrote:

I actually find myself in complete agreement with Balto Wolfdog here. I think it's wrong of you guys to be trashing people for expressing some sort of belief in Santa Claus. Remember that some kids DO visit here, and are younger than ten.

Really, what's the big deal if they say they do? Does it HURT you that they said so? I mean, there are certainly other far more oddball (and really DUMB) things people say on these forums, that can often be worthy of a little jibing. But this?

As Space Ghost once admonished: "Zorak, that's not very Christmas-y." (And then he zapped Zorak.)

Well, lemme tell you something. I haven't met a kid under the age of 9 here, and personally, I wouldn't let a child under the age of at least 10 on a forum or site like this. I mean really.

And WereHam.. or whatever tis name is.. ASKED. So, I wrote my opinion. I know you are all 'lets make them believe in the impossible! 8D'.. Well, thats not me. I mean.. my step-mom sent me this really cool e-mail about how IMPOSSIBLE it was for Santa to be real... Like.. he would have to go 23412312 miles per hour (or something. XD) to get around the world, and thus going that fast you would begin to burn, and he would burn up every year... And like.. die. =]....

Once you hit.. what.. fourth grade?.. I think its a bit much to believe in Santa. ><... I know we all have imaginations... but come on. =]

Grow up.

--MayaHuskee

(deleted user) · **Posted:** Mon Dec 18, 2006 4:23 pm

Jack~MayaHuskee wrote:

BaltoSeppala wrote:

I actually find myself in complete agreement with Balto Wolfdog here. I think it's wrong of you guys to be trashing people for expressing some sort of belief in Santa Claus. Remember that some kids DO visit here, and are younger than ten.

Really, what's the big deal if they say they do? Does it HURT you that they said so? I mean, there are certainly other far more oddball (and really DUMB) things people say on these forums, that can often be worthy of a little jibing. But this?

As Space Ghost once admonished: "Zorak, that's not very Christmas-y." (And then he zapped Zorak.)

Well, lemme tell you something. I haven't met a kid under the age of 9 here, and personally, I wouldn't let a child under the age of at least 10 on a forum or site like this. I mean really.

And WereHam.. or whatever tis name is.. ASKED. So, I wrote my opinion. I know you are all 'lets make them believe in the impossible! 8D'.. Well, thats not me. I mean.. my step-mom sent me this really cool e-mail about how IMPOSSIBLE it was for Santa to be real... Like.. he would have to go 23412312 miles per hour (or something. XD) to get around the world, and thus going that fast you would begin to burn, and he would burn up every year... And like.. die. =]....

Once you hit.. what.. fourth grade?.. I think its a bit much to believe in Santa. ><... I know we all have imaginations... but come on. =]

Grow up.

--MayaHuskee

Well, I think it's unfortunate that you have such a negative attitude towards others who may express their feelings on the matter. Even if they're not being serious.

I mean, I don't believe either, but I haven't thrown any unkind comments at them. Remember the old saying, Maya? "People in glass houses..." Do you know the rest of it? You might want to take it to heart. It takes an immature heart to tear down and away at people for something like this, and at this time of year (let alone ANY time of year).

MayaHuskee · **Posted:** Mon Dec 18, 2006 4:37 pm

BaltoSeppala wrote:

Remember the old saying, Maya? "People in glass houses..." Do you know the rest of it?

No, I don't know it. =].. And pardon me for not being a 'believer'... Bah.

My mom told me something. It wasnt special or anything, but its true. My brother asked "Is Santa real?"... And she said "Well, do you believe he is?"... Duhhhhh. Just because I say something, doesn't mean people listen. =].. Dun dun dun. Smartness to the max. 8D... ><...

Its like almost everyone believes in God.. but do I listen? Not really. =]... XD... Joyous.. somethin'. I dont know anymore. I think I am done here. =]... Wheee.

--MayaHuskee

(deleted user) · **Posted:** Mon Dec 18, 2006 4:41 pm

Jack~MayaHuskee wrote:

BaltoSeppala wrote:

Remember the old saying, Maya? "People in glass houses..." Do you know the rest of it?

No, I don't know it. =].. And pardon me for not being a 'believer'... Bah.

My mom told me something. It wasnt special or anything, but its true. My brother asked "Is Santa real?"... And she said "Well, do you believe he is?"... Duhhhhh. Just because I say something, doesn't mean people listen. =].. Dun dun dun. Smartness to the max. 8D... ><...

Its like almost everyone believes in God.. but do I listen? Not really. =]... XD... Joyous.. somethin'. I dont know anymore. I think I am done here. =]... Wheee.

--MayaHuskee

"People in glass houses shouldn't throw stones". A wise admonishment.

Ecliptica · **Posted:** Mon Dec 18, 2006 4:46 pm

BaltoSeppala wrote:

Jack~MayaHuskee wrote:

BaltoSeppala wrote:

Remember the old saying, Maya? "People in glass houses..." Do you know the rest of it?

No, I don't know it. =].. And pardon me for not being a 'believer'... Bah.

My mom told me something. It wasnt special or anything, but its true. My brother asked "Is Santa real?"... And she said "Well, do you believe he is?"... Duhhhhh. Just because I say something, doesn't mean people listen. =].. Dun dun dun. Smartness to the max. 8D... ><...

Its like almost everyone believes in God.. but do I listen? Not really. =]... XD... Joyous.. somethin'. I dont know anymore. I think I am done here. =]... Wheee.

--MayaHuskee

"People in glass houses shouldn't throw stones". A wise admonishment.

Glass houses and stones^^ totaly awesome like mirror rooms and very fast flashing lights^^

Sorry random I know, but santa, hmm lets see, grr there is little kids on here, it can really damege them so me not saying my thingy agian^^ hehehe

(deleted user) · **Posted:** Mon Dec 18, 2006 5:35 pm

BaltoSeppala wrote:

I actually find myself in complete agreement with Balto Wolfdog here. I think it's wrong of you guys to be trashing people for expressing some sort of belief in Santa Claus. Remember that some kids DO visit here, and are younger than ten.

Really, what's the big deal if they say they do? Does it HURT you that they said so? I mean, there are certainly other far more oddball (and really DUMB) things people say on these forums, that can often be worthy of a little jibing. But this?

As Space Ghost once admonished: "Zorak, that's not very Christmas-y." (And then he zapped Zorak.)

Umm yeah I have to agree, some of these people are taking it to far.

This person asked if Santa was real, and I told them my opinion, as well as other people, but you don't have to bash them for believing.

Let people believe what they want and everybody is happy. 8D [I wish]

But I have to say that Christmas was better when I still believed in Santa, now, I don't even get excited for Christmas. I don't even wake up at 6:00 on Christmas morning like I used to. XD

Random Bunny · **Posted:** Mon Dec 18, 2006 7:16 pm

Here's a little story that I shall share:

I remember my first Christmas adventure with Grandma. I was just a kid. I remember tearing across town on my bike to visit her on the day my big sister dropped the bomb: "There is no Santa Claus," she jeered. "Even dummies know that!"

My Grandma was not the gushy kind, never had been. I fled to her that day because I knew she would be straight with me. I knew Grandma always told the truth, and I knew that the truth always went down a whole lot easier when swallowed with one of her "world-famous" cinnamon buns. I knew they were world-famous, because Grandma said so.

It had to be true.

Grandma was home, and the buns were still warm. Between bites, I told her everything. She was ready for me. "No Santa Claus?" She snorted...."Ridiculous! Don't believe it. That rumor has been going around for years, and it makes me mad, plain mad!! Now, put on your coat, and let's go."

"Go? Go where, Grandma?" I asked. I hadn't even finished my second world-famous cinnamon bun.

"Where" turned out to be Kerby's General Store, the one store in town that had a ! little b it of just about everything. As we walked through its doors, Grandma handed me ten dollars.

That was a bundle in those days. "Take this money," she said, "and buy something for someone who needs it. I'll wait for you in the car. "Then she turned and walked out of Kerby's.

I was only eight years old. I'd often gone shopping with my mother, but never had I shopped for anything all by myself.

The store seemed big and crowded, full of people scrambling to finish their Christmas shopping. For a few moments I just stood there, confused, clutching that ten-dollar bill, wondering what to buy, and who on earth to buy it for. I thought of everybody I knew: my family, my friends , my neighbors, the kids at school, and the people who went to my church.

I was just about thought out, when I suddenly thought of Bobby Decker. He was a kid with bad breath and messy hair, and he sat right behind me in Mrs. Pollock's grade-two class.

Bobby Decker didn't have a coat. I knew that because he never went out to recess during the winter. His mother always wrote a note, telling the teacher that he had a cough, but all we kids knew that Bobby Decker didn't have a cough; he didn't have a good coat. I fingered the ten-dollar bill with growing excitement. I would buy Bobby Decker a coat!

I settled on a red corduroy one that had a hood to it. It looked real warm, and he would like that.

"Is this a Christmas present for someone?" the lady behind the counter asked kindly, as I laid my ten dollars down.
"Yes, ma'am," I replied shyly. "It's for Bobby."

The nice lady smiled at me, as I told her about how Bobby really needed a good winter coat. I didn't get any change, but she put the coat in a bag, smiled again, and wished me a Merry Christmas.

That evening, Grandma helped me wrap the coat (a little tag fell out of the coat, and Grandma tucked it in her Bible) in Christmas paper and ribbons and wrote, "To Bobby, >From Santa Claus" on it. Grandma said that Santa always insisted on secrecy. Then she drove me over to Bobby Decker's house, explaining as we went that I was now and forever officially, one of Santa's helpers.

Grandma parked down the street from Bobby's house, and she and I crept noiselessly and hid in the bushes by his front walk.

Then Grandma gave me a nudge. "All right, Santa Claus," she whispered, "get going." I took a deep breath, dashed for his front door, threw the present down on his step, pounded his door and flew back to the safety of the bushes and Grandma.

Together we waited breathlessly in the darkness for the front door to open. Finally it did, and there stood Bobby.

Fifty years haven't dimmed the thrill of those moments spent shivering, beside my Grandma, in Bobby Decker's bushes.
That night , I realized that those awful rumors about Santa Claus were just what Grandma said they were: ridiculous. Santa was alive and well, and we were on his team. I still have the Bible, with the coat tag tucked inside: $19.95.

May you always have LOVE to share, HEALTH to spare and FRIENDS that care....

And may you always believe in the magic of Santa Claus!

Panic_Wolf · **Posted:** Mon Dec 18, 2006 7:18 pm

It's not really Santa that I believe in, it's the spirit of Christmas. Santa basically IS the spirit. Just knowing he's "coming" is going to bring joy to kid's hearts. Adults have some fun pretending for kids that he is real.

May the spirit of Christmas be with you all this holiday season.

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Is Santa real?