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I saw sketches for Jericho and Jarrett. Is Jarrett the pilot? Which one is Griffin?



I agree. I think Louie could possibly have his place in the pilot, but I don't want him reintroduced if he serves nothing towards the story. He should have a purpose towards the story, not just a cameo role. I wouldn't want to see Louie in there just for the sake of having Louie. But if there's a lot for him to do, yeah! I can see Louie's place being a possible celebration point for Baloo and Kit BUT I also have another idea in mind for another celebration point as well. So yes, he can probably be written in with use but probably sporatic.

Later on I'd like to see a story that focuses on Louie much like Louie's Last Stand.

I agree regarding Karnage; he should be left out of this one. What TaleSpin did better than most series is that TaleSpin didn't rely too heavily on reoccurring villians that never got their way. It ends up being too predictable otherwise. Kind of like "A Bad Reflection On You," it was never too predictable that Karnage was involved.



This isn't really a carbon copy of P&L though so the how the characters play in this story is independently defined.

Yes, I agree in P&L, Wildcat's role was perfect (allowing more room for the central characters) but here for this story I believe there is some room for him in a few scenes. There's enough potential for his character that he can be written in easily (his mechanical abilities would serve the plot and could bail Baloo and Kit out) and I felt that he was underutilized in the series. I'm not really married on using him a lot but with this story, I believe there's some room for him, more so than in P&L. I see him more than a tag-along, background character but not one of the central characters (especially because he's usually in his own world).



His relationship to Baloo is grudgingly allowing Baloo to fly his plane and it gives him an opportunity to give Baloo a hard time because Ignatz is the boss.

Baloo grudgingly flies for him under Kit's insistence and because it's what he is best at (plus the money's good). Ignatz gets two things out of the relationship: the opportunity to give Baloo hell and a good pilot. Baloo does it because it's serves his ego and he gets the money to buy back the Duck. One or the other by themselves isn't good enough for Baloo and Ignatz to set aside their differences; there has to be more than one reason, just like in Polly Wants a Treasure.

Ignatz is Kit's friend but he doesn't know how much H4H means to Kit or how it has affected his life. Ignatz is a friend outside of Kit's family unit at H4H. So I don't see Ignatz really caring about what's going on with H4H unless there is something that directly benefits him. Ignatz just gives Baloo an opportunity to indirectly realize that he's in an equilibrium at H4H.



I agree entirely. In hindsight I should have said something.

But I would think that Khan would already own the major shipping companies in Cape Suzette, especially if he has a fleet of gunships for escort. H4H survives because they serve a demand curve that Khan doesn't bother to mess with: smaller shipments of specialty goods which aren't large enough orders to warrant being shipped on fleet aircraft.

How about this: the Sultan owns metal ore mining in inland Usland, which is useful only for ship building. Khan is the only buyer of his metal and thus holds monopsony power over the Sultan. As the only buyer, Khan buys the ore for dirt cheap and builds ships with it, making a tremendous profit. So the Sultan decides to cut into that profit by integrating downstream into shipbuilding, thus the need to build a shipyard in Cape Suzette (the logistics to supply Cape Suzette with ore is already in place). Then the Sultan can compete directly with Khan with ship building, wooing Khan's employees over to the new shipyard and gaining market share. This would also serve as a foundation for the Sultan to further intrude on other markets supplied by Khan Industries.

I can see it as one news article IF there is a tidbit of information in that article which is of no interest to Khan and the Sultan but is interesting to Becky and motivates her to be greedy. Or possibly two articles next to each other in the newspaper, which would be somewhat ironic because the article Rebecca didn't read sets a chain of events that affects H4H while the article she did read puts H4H in trouble with the events of the other article.

I don't really see gov't benefits that much in this time period either.



I agree. However, I do prefer using characters from the series as much as possible rather than new characters. I haven't seen Baloo Thunder in a while, but is there a possibility that we could replace Griffin with Perry?



I think it reveals too much to the audience too early. The story would be better if we don't necessarily know that Griffin is trying to ruin H4H before it happens. When he's introduced without knowing his real intentions, the reader doesn't have a clue where the story is going to go with Becky and her hairbrained schemes. But when the ONLY reason for Ignatz to say that is to let the audience know, the story gets too predictable.

This can be revealed later in the story, which I've typed way below.



She wouldn't be raving-mad angry; she doesn't like Baloo leaving because he's an important figure in her life. So she's more saddened upset. Becky's pride about her business background (which Baloo lacks) could be enough reason for her not to call Baloo. Plus Becky is jealous that Baloo used his talent (flying) to make a ton of money whereas Becky's talent (business) ran the business into the ground. So she would be ashamed and embarrassed.



Actually, in the series, Molly is sharp and very manipulative. I see your point but then again her ties with Baloo and Kit are so strong that she doesn't really need to comprehend what's going on to fuel her desire to be around Baloo and Kit.



This would make more sense than using Molly.



There isn't focus ON them; they are used as just street thugs just like how Don Karnage's gang is just used as pirates. They serve a purpose in their capacity. I want to tie this into the series as much as possible rather than relying on created characters. Plus, as a "financial expert", there's a lot of things Griffin can't do that he would need thugs to do.

Furthermore, the street thugs are in the very section of Cape Suzette that Sultan is trying to buy up for a shipyard so it seems natural that they would employ "local talent."



They weren't peripheral in that episode considering they acted as a catalyst for an issue between Baloo and Kit.

This is a pilot episode as well without a 22 minute time constraint like a TV episode. There's plenty of room for the two main villians plus whomever else they employ. In fact, if he only focus on the two main villians, the story would be too simple and basic.

The best stories I have ever read had interconnecting side stories that propped up the overall plot by adding layers of complexity, making the story more realisitic. If you have just one plot, with two sides of characters in conflict, then it's boring. It's also not very realistic because for every "story" in real life, there is several interconnecting stories or issues.

I really enjoyed the graphic novels Akira by Katsuhiro Otomo because there were all these little side stories that were relevant to the overall plot but did not directly tie into it. If the novels didn't have all these supporting characters with their own issues, but rather just focused on Kaneda and Tetsuo, it would have been very boring. The characters were more real because they had their own lives, their own issues, and yet they intertwined at the same time. Because of that, you gave more of a ***** about it.

It wouldn't be a big deal, just that Kit runs across them again and this time he gets the upper hand. It also gives us an opportunity to set some scenes in the Cape Suzette docks, which is important to the story. Plus it adds icing to the cake that is Griffin and Sultan.



Yes, I think Ignatz is important at the beginning of the story but much less important as it progresses.



Yes, but without Ignatz revealing who Griffin is earlier in the story:

1) Kit and Baloo leaves Rebecca's apartment, Baloo wants to go eat, Kit decides to head to H4H.
2) Kit eavesdrops on Griffin and the thugs, finds out who he is and his ties to Raceville. The thugs find Kit, but Kit uses his head to get the upper hand and gets away.
3) Kit and Baloo go back to Raceville, Kit asks Ignatz about Griffin.
4) Ignatz tells him what he knows and what Griffin did in Raceville, so Kit tells Baloo and they try to gather evidence.
5) Griffin uses his past ties to get the Sea Duck sabotaged in Raceville, which works when they are trying to return to Cape Suzette.



Umm, yes there is. That's the entire point of the episode: Baloo realizes that he's in an equilibrium at H4H. This is character development. Just like how he went from a lazy bear without a care in the world in P&L to not even being able to fly the Sea Duck without Kit in Stormy Weather.

Actually, I thought the ending of Part 4 of P&L was a little forced: if Baloo wrecked his plane to save Cape Suzette, it seems logical that the city would have paid for it, not Rebecca.



No, this is way too forced. This is like the last episode of Gilligan's Island in which the characters go back on a ship just to be shipwrecked back on the exact same island they left.

Baloo would develop as a character; that's why he's so great of a character. He's a lazy *** who has to learn responsibility. He finds that he cares about H4H, so he has a new motivation to go back. It builds on the B&B relationship that grew in the series. That's the beauty of the pilot, not because everything goes back to the status quo at the end. Actually, I don't really see the point of even doing this if everything goes back to the status quo... that was always a slight problem with the series.

Plus this pilot is trying to go for new ground rather than repeat what's already been said in the series. Having everything return to the status quo, with Baloo losing the Sea Duck again, has already been repeated ad naseum in the series. I don't like Baloo as a static character because he wasn't a static character in the series.

Besides, even with Griffin's crimes in Raceville, there is no way any of the participants in the air race could have known, especially if the air race is legit (and it would have to be to be so big and popular). So there's no logical way Baloo would have to forfeit anything. That would be like the legal employees of a legitament business having their wages garnished entirely by the government just because the owner or owners operated illegal activities outside of the legit business: that would never happen.



This has already been done in P&L so there isn't a lot of possibilites here, just a retread of the status quo. Not much point of that. Plus since we're going to be adapting some of Ann29's stories, I'd like to tie into her stories somewhat.

First off, I want to thank you guys for your feedback! It is very much appreciated!

Wow, where to start...



To straycloud:

About Wildcat, I agree that he should appear more often, probably at least once or twice per episode, as long as his appearances don't seem contrived.

About Ignatz, at the end of Polly wants a treasure, they kinda became friends... Okay so they aren't good friends, but I think they would help each other if the situation necessitated it. And yes, the dialogue will be good. That's one reason I chose Ignatz for this story, because I knew it would be heavy on drama and having him paired with Baloo would provide plenty of comedic moments. Oh yes, they will argue and take verbal jabs at each other, and it will be hilarious.

About the racing plane, should we nix it altogether? I suppose Kit and Baloo could just pilot the Sea Duck. I'm not sure why I included it... If you do think we should keep it then why? I don't feel strongly one way or the other.

About the street thugs, I don't know... maybe we could use them as Griffin's goons, but I don't think they should get much focus or screen time. If they appear, then it' should only be as plot devices. If Kit does avenge himself it should tie in with the plot.

About not revealing Griffith in the first episode, OK, I pretty much agree... So when should he be revealed? The second episode I assume?


Thanks! You're welcome to!

About using Ignatz to connect plot points, yes, I had thought about this, and you are both right. It does seem forced. I think when I wrote this I had been staring at it for so long that everything started to blur together which makes judging story structure difficult. Thanks for your honesty!

About Kit being the first to work with Rebecca, do you mean instead of them getting a call from Molly before Pinch 1 or instead of Rebecca calling Baloo after Pinch 1?

About replacing Ignatz with Wildcat when Baloo and Kit go to Griffin's hideout to hunt for evidence, actually I was thinking about having neither. I have an idea that I may use and if I do then Ignatz and Griffin will know each other, meaning that Ignatz can't go. Also, if Wildcat goes with Baloo and Kit on the first hunt for evidence, then he won't be able to be Rebecca's goon later in the episode because Griffin would know him.

About Rebecca going to rescue Baloo and Kit and try to gather evidence under the cover of being sent by Perry, no Griffin probably wouldn't easily believe this, which is why Rebecca has to put on a flawless performance. If I remember correctly, I wrote it like that because I wanted to give Rebecca a chance to go “toe to toe” with Griffin and outsmart him at his own game. Yes, there's probably a safer plan, but this will be so much more entertaining! Still, I'm not attached to the scene beyond all reason, so I'll still revise it if needed.

I'm not sure what you mean by spelling out the conflicts. I know I can be overly explanatory sometimes, but can you specify what you mean?

I'd say that the kids are the first to recognize H4H as a family, then Rebecca and finally Baloo. Baloo has always seemed to be the more out-of-touch one to me. The kids play a huge part in getting the H4H family back together.

Yes, Ignatz shouldn't be a dispenser of plot points, but I do want to make him a significant character if I can. Also I like his “transformation” from creature to character in Polly Wants A Treasure. Maybe I'm looking too deep, but I think the gag when Baloo opens the treasure chest and Ignatz, who is inside and not clothed, shrieks, covers himself with his wings, and then pulls the chest closed, is connected with the end of the episode where Ignatz shows up wearing clothes and gives Kit money. He's treated as a creature in the beginning and gains respect as a character in the end. Also the way he showed up with a stack of money once makes me think, why not again? It might be handy to have him around as a way to get cash. Of course, it's always last resort because Baloo would have to ask Ignatz for a favor, which he wouldn't want to do since they like to bicker and annoy each other and Baloo doesn't want to owe him anything.



To Phylogeny:

Yes, we should probably at least find a way to integrate some main characters like Louie and Wildcat at the least. I had even toyed with the idea of having the Karnage and the air pirates make a brief appearance, or at least be mentioned in smalltalk, but I don't know... I probably won't even mention Karnage at all. The episode after the pilot can feature him (Gotta keep the Karnage fans happy! ).

And yes, I went crazy with Ignatz and plot points,

About not seeing the connection between Khan's government benefits and Sultan's desire to build a shipyard, or Rebecca's desire to take on more risk: Yeah, this is pretty weak, it's kinda just a stand-in for something better, so feel free to rework that section.

About Sultan dealing directly with Griffin, big corporate types rarely get their hands dirty, instead they do dirty deeds through a p.roxy. (I had to put in a dot because it filtered the word otherwise, which is weird...) I agree also that it would be better to only have Griffin or Perry, but I'm trying to weight the pros and cons of each option and decide which one to use.

About Griffin's background, Here's a question for everyone, Should Griffin be developed as a character even if a suitable existing TS character can be found to fill the role? I personally prefer to use existing characters if at all possible and only create OCs when necessary. For instance I was trying to decide if Perry could replace Griffin completely.

About she doesn't call because she is still sore at him, yes, maybe a little, actually I think it'll be a combination of anger, sadness, embarrassment and disappointment.

About Molly calling seeming kind of unrealistic, I disagree, I envisioned this happening a year after P&L, so everyone is a year older, making Molly seven years old. I think that's plenty old enough for her to understand what's happening. Really all she would have to do is know how to use the phone and be able to read her mother enough to tell something was seriously wrong.

About Rebecca moving to another city, I'm not quite sure why I have three cities... I think I wanted to cause the reader maximum trauma by totally destroying what P&L did. Meaning Rebecca no longer lives in Cape Suzette, but that's probably a bit extreme. I'm fairly sure I'll reduce it to just Cape Suzette and Race-Ville. And yeah, you got me, it was a 'move-out/goodbye scene' chosen specifically for its character interaction possibilities.

About "Collecting evidence against Griffith" seemed kind of vague, I like your suggestion! I mean we'll still need evidence of Griffin's crimes in Cape Suzette because the Race-Ville crimes will be old, but RC could always find the evidence at Miniversal as a result of her position. Or perhaps it could be an “evidence in plain sight” situation. Either way, I like your idea, it makes their case against Griffin even more *****.

About Baloo having no reason to come back to work for RC, Straycloud's comment pretty much sums it up. I do not want to press the reset button on this one, I want lasting character development.



To Straycloud (again, lol)

Griffin is Jericho, a jackal. (Jericho was the working name) The rival pilot is Jarrett, a wolverine (Jarrett is also a working name). The concept art isn't finalized and neither are the names.

About your views on the Baloo-Ignatz relationship, like I said earlier, I think they're kinda friends but their stubbornness keeps them from being overtly friendly toward each other. I believe Ignatz would help Baloo even if Kit wasn't around to ask him to help, he'd just give Baloo hell about it. I think Ignatz cares about other people, especially Kit and also Baloo, he just only makes known his friendship with Kit. As for anyone else he cares about, he makes his feelings far less obvious.

About your ideas on what to do for the catalyzing event (shipyard, government benefits, etc.) I like your idea except for one concern: I don't want to story to get too complicated. Hopefully we can figure out a way to deliver the relevant information in an easy to understand way. I just want to keep in mind that this is a kids' cartoon (no it's not just for kids, but they are the primary part of the audience) so I don't want the plot terribly complicated. Of course I'm not saying it has to be very simple, we just need to find a good balance.

About replacing Griffin with Perry, I just might do that. I have to weigh the option first but that solution has been looking better and better lately.

About not using Molly to inform Baloo and Kit about RC losing H4H, my plan was to have the kids being the main ones pushing Rebecca and Baloo back together initially until they finally admit to themselves that they miss each other. I'm willing to go another route if it turns out to be more effective though. It just seems like it should be the kids to first feel the separation anxiety from the H4H being broken up. Also I wanted Molly to have some sort of important role so she doesn't just seem like a prop.

About using the street thugs, maybe, I'll to weigh the options and we'll have to talk it out more.

About Ignatz being less important after the beginning, I agree. I would like him to maintain a presence though, and I had actually thought about having him be the one that helps RC buy back H4H. I'm not sure why he would do this... probably for Kit because he recognized how important H4H is to Kit. No doubt you guys will have a comment or two about that idea, lol. I just thought it would be unexpected... And I did want to go to the very end of the story after Miniversal has been “defeated” and still not have RC able to buy back H4H. I wanted to make it look like the story might really end without RC being able to get H4H back, until the last minute when Ignatz or whoever comes out with the money to buy back H4H. Just an idea.




Again, thanks for all all the feedback! I can't tell you both how much I appreciate it or how much it helps me!

I want to let you both know that I want to keep this simple by getting rid of all superfluous scenes and characters to minimize the number of “moving parts” in this “machine”. Your feedback helps me do that, thank you!

I'll try to put everything I know I want to do in the story in a concise post soon. Btw, if either of you want to alter the outline to your preferences and re-post it (in this thread), you're more than welcome! Also when the outline is finalized, you're also welcome to help with the writing, in fact I hope you do!

Thanks again to you both for all your help!

No because it's a race so naturally they'd use a racing plane plus I'd like to see Baloo fly something else for a change.

That said, I can see them talking them into flying the Sea Duck for the second race.



Of course they wouldn't get much focus or screen time. Their primary purpose is to tie into the series. I wouldn't really call it avengence... it'd just be funny for Kit to get to use his head and "teach those street goons a lesson" like he wanted to.



Well, when Kit runs into them walking back to H4H after they left Rebecca's apartment.



I don't understand what you're asking, I'm afraid.



That's cool but remember, if H4H closes down, Wildcat is homeless. I would think that naturally he would join Baloo at the air races. But he doesn't have to collect evidence which would resolve Rebecca's goon problem.

I think Ignatz's role would be significantly reduced at this point.



Let's not worry too much about it for now.



Ah, don't worry about it.



Agreed but this is the point where he starts turning around. He sees Kit as a family, now everyone else.



Personally, I'm not a huge fan of Ignatz. Polly Wants a Treasure wasn't one of my favorite episodes although I thought the backgrounds and certain scenes were really good (like when Kit glides into the forest in moonlight.

That said, it doesn't bother me that Ignatz is in this... I don't have anything against him in that regard and he definitely has a place in the story. But I think he'd be more important earlier in the story and less important later on.



Probably not.



Exactly.



Problem is, how is she going to know where Baloo is at? I don't think Baloo is near a phone unless he's at Louie's.



Makes sense because Cape Suzette is properous enough for her to find employment without her incurring moving costs.



I actually like the name Jarrett for a hardass pilot. Griffin sounds cool, too.

We could still use Perry in for Griffin and use Griffin as some sort of other character.



I don't think they're really friends; they have roughly the same kind of relationship Baloo and Don Karnage have (except that Ignatz isn't a villian). Baloo puts up with him more because of Kit, same with Ignatz.



Probably but so would Don Karnage on a good day, honestly, like in Stuck On You.



True, but I think most of it would be explained all at once. Khan buys all the ore from Sultan, Sultan decides to use his own ore to compete with Khan at building ships. Simple as that.



Actually, no, I never saw TaleSpin as a kid's cartoon. I actually appreciated TaleSpin more as a adult than as a kid. I thought TaleSpin was at its best with more mature subjects. The plot won't be complicated but I don't want it too simple, either. The Sultan won't build a shipyard just to build one right

under Khan's nose; he has to have other advantages.

Could we possibly use Griffin in another episode? What are your thoughts on that?



Unfortunately that's how she usually is unless the episode revolves around her or she influences another character like Rebecca or Kit. That said, I like her as a prop. One of her best aspects is that she will openly say things that Kit is thinking but won't say himself.

Molly's a seven-year-old girl and sometimes it's good to just leave her as that.



I've not too keen on this. I think Ignatz has a role but I think this would be too much of a role for him. He should be important at first but later on he's not as important. He's not a central character as far as H4H is concerned.

See, there's the pre-P&L, unstable "orphan pirate" Kit then there's the post-P&L, more stable "H4H" Kit. Ignatz is one of the first friends Kit makes with his life being relatively stable, so I have a problem seeing Ignatz being caught into Kit's other problems. Ignatz is the type of friend Kit likes because it makes his life seem normal and that's where he would want to keep the friendship. I guess a better way to put it is if you went to a high school and you dealt with a lot of drama and problems at that high school, then you went off to college, you wouldn't want to get your college friends involved with problems you have back in your hometown. So I don't see Ignatz being pulled into the drama of H4H outside of telling Baloo and Kit about Griffin/Perry.

I think the H4H problems should focus on Baloo, Kit, and Rebecca with as little outside influence as possible.



If she was defrauded, she wouldn't have to buy it back.

I think it's great that we are having this discussion...it is very interesting to think about the different directions we can take this to.

I guess I hadn't considered not pressing the "reset" button (since that is what the actual show almost always did), but I think you guys are right, some change could shake things up and be a good thing. I was just curious what role you guys envisioned Baloo having at the "new" H4H. If he was to come back to work there I doubt he would want to go back to his original role working as Rebecca's subordinate and taking her orders, now that he owns the Sea Duck again. He would probably want to be on an equal footing with RC at least.

I had an interesting thought relating to 0x7B's last paragraph of his previous post: What if Baloo was the one who helped buy back H4H (with the rest of his winnings?) That would make him an equal partner in the business and set up what should be an interesting season 2.

I am glad you guys are receptive to the idea of having just one of Griffith or Perry, but I actually want to vote against using just Perry. I like the idea of just Griffith better. Let me explain. It's hard for me to imagine someone like Perry coming from a town like Race-ville, just because of what I envision Race-ville being. (This brings up an interesting question, and that is what kind of town DO you guys envision Race-ville being? Please post your thoughts on this!) Personally, when I read the pilot I had this vision of Race-ville as an small, isolated, Las Vegas type of town in a desert/plains setting. It just seemed to fit with the city's corruption and gambling (all those races), and the vast stretches of plains or desert around such a city would be perfect for racing. Perhaps you guys had something different in mind. But this becomes an argument in favor of using Griffith rather than Perry. We pretty much know the main villain will have connections to Race-ville. If we use Griffith we can make him (and Race-ville) basically anything we want them to be. We could not be as flexible if we used a pre-existing character like Perry. Not sure if that explanation made sense, but let me know if it didn't.

Agree with 0x7B's point in his last post about not over-complexifying the plot.

I had another thought about episode 4, and that is maybe Shere Khan (maybe through his elite pilot squad?) helps out unexpectedly in the fight against Miniversal (maybe during the dogfight)? Of course he would not really be "helping" H4H out of kindness...his actions against Miniversal would be mainly for the benefit of Khan Enterprises, with Baloo and the gang receiving indirect benefits. We could tie his actions in some way to the cause of the Miniversal-Khan rivalry in the first episode (whatever we decide that is!). I like this idea because it gives Khan a role in the pilot (and he is a major character in the series), it could be an unexpected surprise in the plot, and it could connect back to the Miniversal-Khan conflict in the first episode nicely, making for nice "bookends" to the whole pilot.

This is a great discussion guys. Please continue to post your thoughts!

To Straycloud:

Ok, we'll keep the racing plane. I do have to agree, as awesome as the Sea Duck is, seeing Baloo fly a different plane would be a welcome change of pace every once in a while.

About the street goons, Ok for now, I still have my apprehensions though. Tell you what, you could write that part as a sample if you want. It'll probably be easier to decide we can see something close to the finished product.

Ok, we'll push the Griffin (or Perry) reveal back to the second episode.

About Wildcat being homeless, I don't think he would. He lives in a houseboat, remember. I assume for the sake of the story that he owns it and that since it's a boat, it's not part of H4H. When H4H gets sold, he could stay there and be the fly on the wall that keeps everyone informed about what's going on in CS or he could move to Race-ville and do maintenance and stuff.

About Rebecca going “toe to toe” with Griffin (or Perry), this isn't a big deal, I just wanted to give RC an chance to get even (kind of) and I thought it would be interesting to focus her venom on someone other than Baloo. My inspiration for this is Ms. Parker from the TV series The Pretender. She was always smart-allecky and sarcastic frequently bordering on downright nasty. (Sorry for the bad video and audio, this was one of the only videos I could find that didn't have music and wasn't an episode. This isn't even that good of an example, she could be much meaner than anything shown in this video.) She was someone you did not want to mess with! Still I'd like to see your version of how RC might save Baloo and Kit and maybe get the evidence.

About Ignatz's role, how extensive should it be? Should he be the race sponsor and that's it? This is ok with me, but I want to use characters that have as much to offer as possible. If Ignatz's role is pretty much fulfilled by the second episode, should he be dropped for another character that can be useful for all four episodes or am I just over-thinking this/worrying too much?

About Perry replacing Griffin, yeah, I'm definitely leaning that way.

About Molly not knowing where Baloo and Kit are, she could call Louie and find out from him. That would also involve Louie which is something we're trying to do.

About the rival pilot's name, ok, we'll use Jarrett unless we think of something better.

Okay, I do agree that Baloo's relationship with Ignatz is similar to his relationship with DK, but since Ignatz's role is reduced in the story, their relationship is less important I guess.

About the plot being overcomplicated, it'll be easier to tell once the outline has been revised again, so I'm not worried at the moment.

Sorry, I have to disagree about using Molly as a prop. She may have been used that way in episodes that didn't primarily feature her, and that's always bothered me a little. Not that Molly is my favorite character because she certainly isn't, I just think the should be respected as a dynamic character. To be honest, she even annoyed me in some episodes. I agree that she is a seven year old girl, and that's how I want to treat her.

About using Ignatz to save H4H, Ok, it was just in idea.

About RC getting H4H back b/c she was defrauded, I don't know, while this seems logical in the real world, for the story it seems too easy and anti-climactic. Surely we can come up with something more interesting.




To Phylogeny:

Don't sweat it that we're not pressing the reset button, (not that you were) because the character dynamics won't change hardly at all when Baloo comes back to H4H as owner of the Sea Duck. We can work out the details of how exactly the character dynamics will be affected by Baloo's buying back the 'Duck later after the pilot it finished. Remember, we're the writers, so it's all in our hands!

About having Baloo use him remaining winnings to buy a partnership in H4H, I had thought this, and I may take that route, but the only thing that makes me hesitate is that if Baloo owned a part of H4H, that might give him too much power which could negatively affect character dynamics. Of course, Baloo could later sell his stake in H4H back to RC to cover his tab at Louie's or something, lol!

About using Griffin rather than Perry, I have to disagree at the moment. I'd just rather use an existing character if at all possible. He was only in one episode and it didn't give any background on him, so it's still wide open. Don't worry, we'll just take the bio slated for Griffin and apply it to Perry.

About what type of city Race-ville is, a desert/plains La Vegas type city sounds good to me. I don't have a problem envisioning Perry living in a place like that. It seems to fit him nicely in my opinion. (He might not have grown up there, but he could have always moved there because of the business opportunities.)

About using Khan to help defeat Miniversal, I had thought of this and I can't decide if it's a good idea... While it would give Khan a role in the pilot, it would also take some of the credit/glory away from the H4H gang. There are pros and cons and I'm having a difficult time making up my mind, though I do like the idea of bookending the story with Khan.




Okay, I think we're almost ready to revise the outline. I just want to make sure we're all on the same page.

If we go with Perry instead of Griffin:

Perry will get the background fleshing out that was slated for Griffin (who may be used in another episode, we'll have to discuss the possibilities.).

Perry used to be a political or business leader in Race-ville and helped to bring racing the city.

He was a sponsor of a pilot, eventually got greedy corrupted, etc, sabotages other racers, is caught, jailed for a time, and released.

He moves to CS or wherever we decide Miniversal is located and gets a job under Mr Sultan.

“Baloo Thunder” happens

Perry and Baloo (and Kit) know each other from “Baloo Thunder”, but Rebecca, Molly and Wildcat have never seen him (right?).



>>>ep 1
RC and Sultan read that Khan Inc. has broken ground on a new shipyard and this has caused his stock prices to skyrocket. (I'd like to integrate some kind of risk on Khan's part here too.)

Miniversal needs large tracts of land on the waterfront to build a shipyard to compete with Khan's shipping business.

Rebecca is envious of Khan's success and wants similar success for H4H, prompting her to take greater risks.
***catalyst

One of Mr. Sultan board members suggest they use less than legal means to obtain the needed land. He is reluctant, but gives in because he really doesn't want to lose to Khan again. He calls Perry (who no longer works at Miniversal) to contract him to manage the land grab.

RC speaks with Perry while Baloo and Kit are at the race.

Baloo enters and wins air race, sponsored by Ignatz. The rival pilot, who is very competitive, impulsive and aggressive, and his sponsor, who is normal and a little intimidated by his pilot, do not get along.

Baloo buys back the Sea Duck with race winnings.

Perry reports to Sultan

***plot point 1
>>>ep 2

Rebecca loses H4H b/c of Perry's con.

Baloo wins more money in another race.

Baloo and Kit find out RC lost H4H. (However we decide, by Molly or Kit or whoever/however.)

Baloo and Kit meet RC at H4H. (goodbye scene)

Baloo and Kit move to Race-ville and RC takes a (very nice) job at Miniversal with high level access (but doesn't leave CS I suppose).
***pinch 1


(I want this all to be “sickeningly fortunate in a twisted kind of way”. Baloo gets the 'Duck but loses H4H and Rebecca loses H4H, but ends up in a better position making more money at Miniversal. A “careful what you wish for” scenario. Her new job is in CS, although I did think about how it would look if illustrated... To me, a completely different skyline/climate would seem more severe a change to the reader/viewer than something more familiar. Wildcat could stay in his houseboat which we'll assume he owns (not all the time, just when he's not being used) in CS.)

(I'd like to also work out the details of the con if you guys think it's important. I'd like to get away from the taxes and government benefits angle and simplify things if possible.)


She finds incriminating documents but DOES NOT keep them. Someone surprises her and she slams the file cabinet or something. This provides something to have to obtain later, say, at the end of ep 3 or maybe at the beginning of ep 4?

She calls the police but they are no help. (We can come up with details of why later.)

??? Back at Race-ville, Baloo and Kit are finding out about Perry's past and plan (or is this too early?) from Ignatz. If we decide to use him. From who/How else could they learn this. Maybe from the rival pilot's sponsor, or maybe we could save this for the end of ep 3 to sometime in ep 4 and hear it from Perry himself. I'm open to suggestions.

RC calls Baloo about the document she found. (Maybe Molly bugs her to call Baloo about it, I don't know... I just want Molly to have a useful function beyond just a prop or a plot device.)

RC tells Baloo about Perry's Business front and also the address. (Maybe it was on the document she found, if he doesn't find out from RC, then who?)

RC's conversation with Baloo was overheard by someone in on the scheme who reports it to Perry, putting her in danger. (I'm wondering if Perry might try to keep the fact that RC knows about the scheme away from Sultan for fear of losing the contract or some other negative consequence.)

Perry reports to Sultan again.

***midpoint
>>>ep 3

Baloo decides to help RC despite her request that he not interfere.

Baloo and Kit go to Perry's headquarters to try to obtain evidence while Perry is away but Perry returns and Baloo and Kit are unsuccessful in collecting evidence.

They recognize Perry from Baloo Thunder and accuse him of the land grab scheme but he calmly denies it and shows him hi companies books assuring them that his business is legitimate. They don't believe him and leave.

Perry decides to sabotage the 'Duck on the next race to make it look like an accident. (He has to find out where they are and how to hit them. Maybe he could find a ticket stub or a special pass to the race coarse in race-ville.)

Perry contacts (or meets with) the rival -pilot, whom he used to sponsor and was/is friends with, to set up the sabotage.

Baloo and Kit are forced down by the rival pilot during the next race, captured and taken to Perry's headquarters.

Either Ignatz or Wildcat find a clue in the 'Duck as to what happened to Baloo and Kit and contact RC to tell her what happened.

RC goes to Perry's headquarters to free Kit and Baloo. (If we keep this scene as is) She puts on a great Ms. Parker act with Wildcat as her goon.

Perry is fooled (barely) and RC rescues Baloo and Kit but she DOES NOT collect evidence, she will get the document from Miniversal. (Or in addition to the document from Miniversal, Baloo or Kit could smuggle evidence they find (something small and easily hidden) from Perry's HQ, this would provide evidence linking the locations. It would also give the whole “Baloo and Kit get captured” sequence a point besides showing that the H4H gang sticks together.)


***pinch 2


Maybe Perry could find out that RC wasn't sent by Sultan when he reports to Sultan and mentions RC, Baloo and Kit. This could be played different ways depending if Perry has tries to hide the fact that RC knows about the Scheme. Actually, Miniversal/Perry finding out RC knows about the scheme could be put off till now, meaning RC would be relatively safe until now.

Perry could be defeated here, or it could be put off till the beginning of ep 4.

***plot point 2
>>>ep 4


We obviously need to flesh ep 4 out.

Epic Dogfight.
Miniversal is defeated.
***showdown

Baloo returns to H4H

We need to work out the conditions of the ending too, like who saves H4H and Baloo and RC new business and personal relationship.

***end


So there it is. Your ideas are welcome! How do we end this thing? I have a few ideas I need to refine a bit more before I post them, but don't wait on me, I want to see everyone's ideas! As long as the specified character development is accomplished and the story is interesting and entertaining then I'm happy. I'm probably forgetting to mention some things... I'll post them when I remember, lol.

Thanks again for your input! (This goes for anyone reading this!)

Wow, wow...Sorry, I'll make a short answer, but I promise to take the time to read all this properly.
Although, here's my feeling on this : this is an incredible plot, and I'm amazed that you can build a story like this without being a writer (especially for someone like me who has no imagation...)

But : isn't it a little too complex? There are a LOT of characters involved, a lot of situations, and it seems to require to know a lot of the characters past to understand what's going on.
I mean, I thought the aim was to introduce the series to people who don't know it, or to people who haven't seen it since a long time - I think they'll be lost with a plot like this. (and I'm not even talking about kids being able to understand half of it...I know Talespin had complex stories, but here the bar is raised)

BUT, as a fan of the series, I am more than pleased. I guess that's a choice to make, it's not possible to please everyone. I suggest to simplify some of it though - I would go against adding more characters, especially if they're not necessary. And merging Griffin with Perry would probably be good, because they don't appear to have that much of a distinct role. Same for making Becky work at Cape suzette instead of another city, this would simplify a bit.

I know it's not possible when you write an outline like this too, but when writing the screenplay or fanfic, we should not forget about humor; one big mistake would be to make it too serious, when it should be "light" just like most episodes of the series. The main plot can be serious, but the situations can be taken with humor.

As I said, I'll give more of my opinion later.

EDIT : I just read the latest posts, and I can see I'm not the only one thinking it needs some simplification. It will also help when actually writing it, so that it doesn't take ages and goes in every possible direction....

This isn't more complex than P&L. The reality is that the people who are more apt at viewing this are already fans of the show.

It looks complex looking at the paragraphs, but I don't think it's really complex. I mean could you provide input on how and why it's complex to you?

If people are entertained by it, none of the above will matter.

My suggestion is that we need to just focus on bits of the story at a time. Everyone should just start at the beginning, start fleshing out the story from there, and keep going. Going back and skimming through all the messages from the past few days, it looks like everybody is trying to build a train track by laying all the tracks down at the same time. Everyone should just start laying tracks at the beginning and let it naturally progress with a probable destination in mind.

Just start at the beginning, episode 1, and ignore all the rest of the episodes for now.



They won't play a large role. If anything, it saves time and energy drawing characters already designed from the show.
I just like the idea of the viewers finding out the plot at the same time as Kit rather than the plot be revealed to the viewers earlier on. Plus I like connecting this story to events that occurred in the series.



True, but I think we're overanalyzing here. Let's just play it by ear as the story progresses.



Probably mostly as a race promoter and a little more (like in my messages above) and nothing more. He's a one-off character from the series and I just don't think he would be involved with what's surrounding H4H.

"About Molly not knowing where Baloo and Kit are, she could call Louie and find out from him. That would also involve Louie which is something we're trying to do."

Yes but that's probably irrelevant to the overall story when you think about it.

"Sorry, I have to disagree about using Molly as a prop."

I meant that she was more or less a prop in the series. I liked her character, don't get me wrong, but her primary role was to keep Rebecca from looking like a total bitch, not to be a character in her own right. Think about it, if Rebecca acted the way she did without Molly, Shere Khan would look better in comparison.



I tend to prefer realism over suspension of disbelief in these situations.



That works, but you could also consider Raceville to be a floating platform in the sky.

I agree with this. Straycloud, I understand what you're saying that people likely to view this are already fans of the show, but there's no reason not to try to make the pilot reachable to as many people as possible...we can bring in the more casual fans who may have seen an episode or two, liked them, but haven't necessarily seen all of them. That's why I'm a little apprehensive about alluding too much to one-off episodes in the series. People who haven't followed the show closely or seen that particular episode may get lost and lose interest. So I would like to propose that we not make any major plot points in our pilot rest on something that happened in a one-off episode of the series. That said, I think the occasional allusion to something that happened in the series (non-critical to the plot) would be enjoyable for the more devoted fans out there.



Meh. I'm okay with using Perry but I'm just not crazy about the idea. I just don't feel he is right for the story we are writing. Maybe it's because it just feels weird to take a character of someone else's design and assign him a pretty detailed background that we came up with, when the creators might have had something totally different in mind. Don't get me wrong, I like Perry as a character...just not in this episode since we are focusing on this character's past. I feel like we could write Perry into future episodes where his past wasn't an issue.

I'm not sure I understand your reluctance to use brand-new characters. We have already decided to make a couple of big changes to the original series: using story arcs and changing the dynamics of H4H (giving Baloo back the Sea Duck.) Creating a new villain or two is not really a big deal compared with that.

I guess my point is, I don't see much reason NOT to use Griffith, while I do see some advantages of doing so (basically being able giving him whatever personality and background we need to suit our story).

Other stuff:
I like straycloud's suggestion of not laying down everything at once and focusing on less at a time. I think we have basically agreed where our destination is (having Miniversal defeated and Baloo coming back to H4H, this time owning the Sea Duck) so exactly how we get there, we can discuss on the way. Great suggestion, straycloud!

I had an idea for an opening sequence to Episode 1...I'll post it later in the week.

I wrote up an opening for Episode 1, based on 0x7B's outline. Please feel free to suggest any changes. Sorry it's in PDF - I wanted to post it directly in the thread (easier for you guys to suggest changes), but it was hard to get it to format correctly. Let me know if there's an easier way.

Episode 1 - Opening Draft

Rest of things to accomplish in this episode:
-Baloo and Kit arrive in Raceville, get reacquainted with Ignatz
-Rebecca meets with Griffith/Perry (although his true intentions are not revealed until later)
-Baloo wins race, beating Jarrett in the process
-Baloo buys the Sea Duck back with race winnings

BTW, I used the Celtx software 07xB recommended to write this. Love this software!

First I want to say to Phylogeny, nice job on the draft! The flow and characterization are really good! I liked the crystal galssware bit and the newspaper headline was nice as well! Don't worry about the pdf format, it's fine. I can't speak for everyone else, but I can open pfds in my browser, so it's no trouble for me.

I'm glad you like Celtx! To me, it's one of those programs that's just so cool you can't not use it. Plus, it's hard to beat free!

Anyway... The only part of the draft I would change would be the opening scene where Baloo and Kit meet Jarrett. It wasn't in the outline, (sorry 'bout that) but Jarrett doesn't become a real threat until the third ep or so. I imagined their first encounter with Jarrett would be at the airfield. Maybe they would be walking past the planes parked on the field and see Jarrett arguing with his sponsor about something, possibly prize money, but they do not interact immediately.

Also, Baloo and Kit don't know about Ignatz until they meet him at Race-ville. For instance, Baloo and Kit go to get tickets; the line is long. They see people (the pilots, sponsors and other VIP) entering through another gate bypassing the line. Kit recognizes Ignatz in the group and yells to get his attention. Ignatz comes over and they greet each other. Ignatz tells them that he's a sponsor but has no pilot (for whatever reason) and Kit suggest that Baloo fly in the race. They are reluctant but Kit talks them into it. Ignatz leads them to the race plane and tells them about the race rules and route, and he also cautions them to watch out for the other pilots because they sometimes cheat.

At this point they pass by Jarrett who yells to Ignatz, saying that he's sorry (sarcastically) Ignatz has to forfeit because his pilot quit (or whatever). Ignatz responds that he does have a pilot. Jarrett points to Baloo and ask “Who? Him?” They all nod. Jarrett just laughs and makes jokes about his weight, etc... They exchange verbal jabs for a moment until the PA announces that the race is about to start. They separate and Ignatz takes Kit and Baloo to his plane. Ignatz warn them to be especially of Jarrett The race begins.

I had a thought today that the race should be to fetch or deliver an object somewhere scenario, similar to From Here To Machinery because that would force them to land, thus making them vulnerable to sabotage or attack. I want to continuously raise the tension and the stakes over the course of the story, meaning that Jarrett can't come off as too big of a threat too soon. To give you an idea, I probably wouldn't have a dogfight until at least the last part of ep 2 or the beginning of ep 3. Of course, that doesn't mean we cant have an exciting race with lots of tension filled moments exasperated by the dirty tricks Jarrett loves so much. (Dirty tricks that get progressively more threatening.)


I still have a few things I'd like to work out...

For starters, does the Race-ville - shipyard connection seem too weak or contrived or is it just me? As I'm sure you know, the only reason I put the air race in the story was to add some action and adventure. You may have read the first version where Baloo wins the money to buy back the 'Duck at Ignatz's casino... That was too boring so I changed it to an air race. If anyone can think of a good way to force sizable portions of the story into the air to create the needed action while being better connected to the external conflict, that would be good. My fear is that this might turn out like the The Chronicles of Riddick... like two different movies poorly grafted together. Then again maybe I'm just being paranoid... I do that sometimes.

As for the villain, (Perry/Griffin/Jarrett) I don't think we should develop them or provide a background because it isn't vital to the story and it would leave more time to tell the story and develop the H4H characters. The only reason I can think of to develop a villain would to make him a recurring baddie, and I don't see these guys being recurring baddies...

As for the Perry/Griffin question, we could:

A)
Use both Perry and Griffin as “business partners”, where one plays a support role for the other and one has associations with Race-ville. We can probably dispense with goons until they join up with Jarrett later in the story around ep 3. The reason for this is to cut down on characters to worry about and to simplify things. Besides, they're pulling a white-collar con on business, so big, dumb, over-sized goons would probably look out of place in that situation. Goons shouldn't be needed until ep 3 or so, and I think Jarrett could probably play a goon... If not we can always give them goons when they're needed.

Personally, I think this is the best way to go. This combines the best aspects of 'B' and 'C'. I'm starting to remember why I wrote the outline using both characters... Very few cons are done by a lone conman, most have at least one or more accomplices to help them. (Yes, the con would have Miniversal to help them, but as Miniversal would want to distance themselves from any illegal activity, they wouldn't be able to directly help until later in the story, say ep 3 or 4, where the stakes are sufficiently high enough to warrant their direct involvement.) Also this way they could have each other to talk to, allowing Kit to overhear about the con. Not to mention Kit and Baloo would recognize Perry and just know that he's up to no good.

B)
Use Perry and Jarrett plus a goon or two but NOT Griffin. In this case, Perry would not be given any association with Race-ville before Baloo Thunder, instead he could meet Jarrett another way. Maybe they know each other because Perry attends the air race and always bets on Jarrett, or maybe because Perry sponsored him at one time. In other words, we wouldn't assign Perry a background/past before Baloo Thunder at all. The benefits of this option are that since Perry is an existing character who already has ties to Miniversal, and his role in Baloo Thunder suggests that he would make a good villain. Also, the artists could just copy his character design from the original show, which would save some time.

C)
Use Griffin and Jarrett, but NOT Perry. This option is pretty much the same as 'B' just the Villains are switched. The benefits to this option are that since Griffin is an OC, we could give him any association with Race-ville or past we want. Also the personality would be wide open as well. The downside is that a new character would have to be (a least somewhat) fleshed out, but this isn't a really big issue.

Another thing I was thinking about: Does Perry get fired from Miniversal after Baloo Thunder? (No, that wasn't mentioned in the episode.)
If so:
Sultan would have to contact him and hire him for the scheme and convince him to do it. It would also change the rapport between them, as Perry would probably resent being fired.
If not:
He would be on hand from the beginning (ep 1) to provide the idea and handle the scheme. Also the rapport would be normal.



Finally, should there be a sub plot? Possibly involving Louie and/or Wildcat? Just a thought.

Thanks for the feedback everyone!

At the moment I'm not going to get too much into something because I'm not too familiar with, but I will. The plot changes and ideas that some of you guys are planning seem ok to me. As this being a too complex story I have to contradict that. Sometimes the writing part seems confuse because is just being elaborated. P&L had a few things going on at the same time as outside conflicts. the lightning gun was in fact just a way the writers invented to make Karnage the invader, but then it came the lightning rock, the bank wanting to take Baloo's air service back, Baloos plan on selling the Rock to Kahn, and many other things going around. I said originally, I forgot where, that this pilot had to have lots of action and a complex plot. Let’s be honest... this is oriented to fans of the show, people who love the show from the beginning. Probably we could get some new young fans but that will be extra.


Now, something I have to say... after the pilot is completely written I believe the next episode has to be slower, not as dramatic and full of action and complex as this one. Perhaps a comedy one with Wildcat and Clementine. Any ideas?



Expect more from me on this later on next week as I’m able to read all of these. Wow!! I’ve been away for a while.


I'm going to be working on a comic for the talespin VS Promotionals. If you want to join in please send me an e mail to [email protected]

I added that scene in because I wanted to establish Jarrett as a villain and foreshadow the threat he will pose later in the story. But I agree the scene above can also accomplish this....I'll give it a rewrite and post it here.

I don't know about you, but I think it makes our story more interesting if Jarrett is portrayed as more ruthless and "evil" than say, Coolhands (from the episode 'Feminine Air' where he played the similar role of a rival pilot). I see Jarrett as the type of person who would not think twice about shooting down another plane if it helped him to win a race.



I actually think the air race works great! I see it as similar to the race in "Phantom Menace" in Star Wars (which overall wasn't a very good movie, but the racing scene was spectacular and played an important role in the story).

As for the connection between the two cities, I posted earlier that I think the connection would be strongest if Perry/Griffith turns out to be a major figure from Raceville (perhaps connected with the underground there) and there is evidence in Raceville that would allow the authorities in Cape Suzette to arrest him. On the way to Cape Suzette to deliver the evidence, the Sea Duck is sabotaged and Baloo and Kit are captured. (I think this makes more sense than the original outline which has them go to Griffith's hideout which is in CS to look for evidence, then go all the way back to Raceville just to have their plane sabotaged so they can be brought back to CS. Why would they go back to Raceville? Wouldn't they stay in CS if they are trying to help Rebecca?)



I agree. I don't think we should flesh out the bad guys too much. However, we should provide enough background necessary so that the story makes sense. I think establishing Perry/Griffith's position in Raceville is necessary to provide that "connection" between the two cities already mentioned.




I vote for A) as well. My only worry with that one is that there would be too many villains to keep track of. But I think we can make it work. Here's my idea: Sultan could play much less of a role in the story and Perry would act as the Miniversal representative for the duration of the plot. For example, at the board meeting in the rough draft, Sultan could simply assign responsibility for the con to Perry. Perry would then be the one saying "I know just who to call" and making the call to Griffith. After this point I see Griffith reporting his progress directly to Perry, while Sultan pretty much drops out of the main storyline...he wouldn't want to get his hands dirty anyway. Sultan could resurface at the end when the story is resolved.


I think we should just keep the rapport between Sultan and Perry as normal (ie Perry is just on hand from the beginning). Remember, not everyone has seen Baloo Thunder so those who haven't wouldn't see any reason for Perry to be fired from Miniversal.

I think our story is complex enough without a subplot! I think Wildcat will automatically get enough screen time during the course of this story so we won't need anything "extra" for him. Looking at our almost finished version of the story, I'm not sure I see a place for Louie...but I think that is fine since he is not one of the central characters of the series (I would say Wildcat > Louie in terms of importance to TS).

Yeah I agree. I would say the complexity is at a good level now. Interesting without being too hard to understand.



I totally agree. Our pilot _has to_ be exciting to draw readers back into the series, but it is good to mix things up a little.



Awesome! I can't wait to see this. I particularly hope we're able to bring in some more artists! Can't wait to see what some of our pilot will look like in comic form!

problems with ISP. This will ahe to wait. I'll let you guys know. I'm still going to work on this but no one will be able to see. perhaps I'll have to mae a pv network on hamachi or something

I'm glad you think so. That makes me feel better about this.


Yes a lighter episode will definitely be in order after the pilot is finished. As for the subject, I hadn't really given it much thought... If I think of something I'll be sure to add it to the brainstorming thread.


Agreed. As long as it's gradual. I see him as a little like Don Karnage, in that he's relatively calm and composed as long as things are going his way, but he flips out and starts shooting when things don't go according to plan.


I'm glad you think so. I was desperate to force some action into this thing so it wouldn't end up a drama fest.


Good, then we're in agreement.


The villains shouldn't be too confusing since they'll operate as a cohesive unit, similar to the air pirates. (For most of the story anyway... They may start to fracture apart and turn on one another once things start to go south.)


My thoughts exactly.


That's my preference too.


Yeah, you're probably right. In any case, let's finish the draft and then if we think it can support a sub-plot without over-complicating things or being too distracting from the main story, then we can consider adding one. (It's not looking very likely at the moment though.)