Written by Mighty :
Used with permission. Banner © Hecate
Some of you may be aware of the fact that a lot of us older members are upset over the fact that people are here for all the wrong reasons. This news is what this news will be focusing on.
Yes, this fan site is out of control, and needs to be fixed. At this rate Animation Source has gone above and beyond the words "fan site". So I would like you to ask yourself, am I truly a fan? Think hard, and think seriously. Because if you are a truly a fan of whatever site you may spend your time on, then you wouldn't be using this site as a character hub. You would be sending in submissions of strictly fan related content. Animation Source is not an alternate site for Deviantart. Nor is this a character hub. I've seen a lot of people who come here and make nothing but characters.
I would also like to stress the fact that this makes this site not able to function like it should. How? Well, let's take me for example. It makes it harder for me to post a fan news when there isn't much of any content worth sharing. You see where I'm going with this? No food=no dinner. This can also be said for the selection of the week. Sometimes this can be the fault of the mods, but sometimes it can also be the fact that there isn't anything to rotate to.
The following quote is by Imagine, and I have received her okay to post it here.
Link to post | The topic itself
"There's a difference between liking something and being a fan of it.
To like something, in terms of fan art, means to just draw something related to a movie or TV show and post it somewhere, (something like that) and it's okay if you only like something!
A true fan would be completely committed to drawing only characters from from that particular movie or TV show. Well, not 24/7 obviously, but on a fan site dedicated to that movie.
I like a lot of things. Oranges, pencils, vacations, softball, wasting time on the internet XD and if we're talking about movies. Animated--Lion King, Beauty and the Beast; Live Action--Just Go with It, Benchwarmers, and Valentine's Day (I'm a sucker for comedies XD)
But if I want to be a FAN of these things...I would be almost obsessed with them!
And then there is the size of fan. Meaning are you a BIG fan...or only a small fan? This is where it gets tricky... and I also think it's kinda hard where to draw the line between a fan, and a person who only likes it, especially if they claim to be a fan/not a fan. If it were easy, the problem would already be solved.
Here's the dictionary.com definition of "fan."
..."an enthusiastic devotee, follower, or admirer"...
Enthusiastic. That's the key word in there. I have to admit I might be contradicting myself the more I write this, and that may be the problem this site has had for a long time. There is no device telling you how many fan arts of Balto you post in order to become a fan, or how many semi to non-related stuff you post in order not to be a fan. People have to decide that for themselves, and people...have their own opinions on such things. And BAM! Explosion of fights, flames, and wars reek havoc on innocent members...Bum bum buuuum!"
As of May 16th, the character hub idea has been voted out.
That doesn't mean that this over, and that you will be able to proceed with your characters. We're now considering a committee.
I would highly recommend, if you haven't already, to move ALL of your non-related characters to DA. Or any other site that you may be a member on that accepts art.
Do you guys remember my joke from last month? The joke that all your characters will be moved to a new site? Well, this idea may just come to life (NOTE: This is just an idea. It may or may not happen, so don't panic). Like I said above, a lot of you seem to focus only on your characters, and a lot of them, at least from what I've seen, isn't even related to Balto. A lot of us members have thought that this site would be a good idea (Steet is okay with the idea). And before you go and say, "but this is Animation source". Any of you remember Gamebook Land (no longer exists)? Well, Animation Source didn't exist at the time, but this site was completely indipenant from from Balto Source and the Lion King Source.
Quote by Steet | The topic itself
"- The difficulty of what is allowed or not is the main problem, as it can't be something really objective. As we've seen previously, having a character being "related" to a Balto character just doesn't work because people cheat.
- On the french side, since about 6 months, the characters must be activated before being on the site, and the moderators are filtering what comes in. It seems to work, but let's not forget that the amount of characters being validated on the french side is not even 1/10 of what's on the english site! Also, more submissions and more mods = conflicts over what should be allowed or not.
- And I remember that when mods had to validate characters on the english side, there were lots and lots of characters in the waiting list, always, no matter how many mods.
Here's what I suggest :
- Making the "Characters Source" site as suggested, and on this site, allow any kind of characters (as long as it respects the no-sex, no-violence rule), and no validation required by the mods.
- But on any other site, the submissions will have to be validated, and mods will filter what comes in.
- Then, I would post a news on the sites to let everyone know about this change, and allow them some time to move their "wrong" characters and art there.
- After that while, mods will be allowed to filter and delete any art/character that doesn't fit a site."
What classifies as not related?
Sparkle dogs
unrealistic designs
wings
legwarmers
pircings
scarfs
Anything that can be described as scene dog/emo dog, etc. If it can't happen in the movie of concern, then chances are you shouldn't send it.
Also, this doesn't mean you can't be creative, so don't go there. You can be just as creative with a realistic dog that is related to the movie of concern.
What is allowed?
Realistic colors and markings
Collars (if the animal of concern can wear one)
Relation to Balto. And not just: He lives in nome, or he knows Balto. Try and be more complex and devolop the character.
Your own version of one of Balto's un-named pups, or a character that was seen but has no name.
Human characters, but keep in a style that is from that time period.
If you're interested in helping in restoring this site, then this is how you can help: Go through your galleries and delete anything that shouldn't be there. Go through your characters and clean them out. Send in content related to the site. The last thing you can do is use this banner here in your profile. But ONLY if Hecate says you can, she's very picky on who uses it.
So that will be all for now. Have a nice day!
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Comments
Whispere
r
I decided to go with the idea of a Committee and for the members to have temporary mod status (with accountability) so that our mods wouldn't get flooded with hundreds of reports. Plus, no one who was trying to help would know what characters have already been reported, and there would be no way for them to communicate with other good willed members on the subject of who should be detected a why. Having a Character Board will help define those rules, and save the present, and future mods, a LOT of head aches. My heart does goes out to the mods, and I can only imagine how great there days would be if everyone who has voiced an opinion so far went through the pages and started reporting characters at their own will. Some character that could have stayed would end up getting deactivated, and some character that should have been deactivated would be left unless there is communication within those who are reporting/deactivating.
And the Board members wouldn't need to be given mod status at all, really. If communication is established, then all the aforementioned problems would no longer be a concern, and the Borad members could limit how many character reports are given daily throughout the month's time. The mod status was simply so they could save the current mods some headaches and deactivate the characters themselves, but if -like I said- communication can be reached, then that wouldn't be necessary.
(Just a little Doctor Who reference that was too good to pass up! Free of charge BJ )
Wolf
Razor
Wolf
And don't be so hard on yourself Rose! Everyone has expressed important views and ideas, and we have all been building on each other! Your idea is basically the core of my plan, when you think about it! I didn't make it alone, I had some wonderful inspiration from these other great members and mods!
Rose
I had an idea similar to this, but I basically just proposed that non-Mod members help the Mods by searching through the pages upon pages of characters and reporting those that needed deleted. This committee idea just makes my idea look like nothing though! I really think that if this committee can consist of dedicated members who won't leave the committee after a couple of days or a couple thousand complaints. Because, lets face it, there is a large chunk of AS that will be very ticked off that they can't get away with unrelated characters anymore. If this committee does go through, the members will have to be prepared to deal with lots of complaining and rude comments.
Whispere
r
Hecate: I quite agree on the topic of sparkledogs. It would be perfect for other members if we could come up with a way to show other members what is "sparkle" and what is not. The hard part would be doing that for Every single realistic color. Other than that I find that to be a great idea.
Brown Wolf: I agree with you Completely about characters. Personally, I think that we just have to get rid of the "sparkle" and non-related characters and fanworks to get the Sources back to what they were like in 2007-2008 essentially.
Lady_Aniu (Dizzy): You really gave a detailed suggestion... I must say that I agree with the idea of a committee, but I think that it would need to consist of members that have been on for a decent amount of months/years/ect. as well as mods and the webmaster himself. This would help to present all of the details and problems as some members that have been here for awhile can help to point out things that a mod may not particularly think of. (I think Very highly of Mods, I merely think that other experienced members would also help.)
Rather than type up a long comment on your whole idea I will merely summarize it in this: The plan that you have suggested in total makes very clear sense and I agree that it would give time for members to try and fix their characters and fanworks before the rules are officially set in stone. This would make for a great plan of action.
Whispere
r
DT: I quite agree with you there. It makes sense and is quite reasonable should it be put in place. Here are my thoughts on the points that you made:
1. This is a perfectly logical idea. We had moderators specifically for characters before, so it would be perfectly fine in my opinion to have them again. (That would also help cut down on the number of unfinished/no bio whatsoever characters.)
2. I think that that would be a good idea. It would be better than making a limit number in my opinion... The percentage idea certainly is better. That way true fanart would make a very good percentage of the art on the site should this be enforced the way that we are discussing.
3. That is the biggest problem that I see (after sparkle and unrealistic characters) here on the Sources. Many people try to get away with "[character] lives in Nome" or something similar without a True connection. The characters that I have kept here all have a close connection.
4. This is the most challenging part... It would take an organized (and mature) group of members/mods to come up with the rules, but I do think that compromises and discussion would make it work smoothly.
Mighty: I agree with you that it may not be the best idea. It would be a step towards moving the site back to being more of a FAN-site though, so I'm still not totally opposed.
2) A warning should then be made very clear, by posting on the news or such, that a "cleansing" will be taking place through out all of the Sources, getting rid of unrelated characters and deactivating images that are unrelated. A time limit should also be given for members to do some of their own house cleaning, or to change/save their characters and images. The members of their respected groups will then go about addressing issues. The Character Board will contact members in regards to characters that will be deactivated, as well as the creators of characters that could be saved, and given a chance to do as, as well as a guide on how to do it. The Gallery Board will also contact members whose galleries are in the worst shape, and either give them instructions on how to improve their galleries to meet the new quota, or a warning that certain images will be deactivated.
3) In a month/month and a half's time after the announcement (a date clearly defined in the announcement), characters/images will begin disappearing as the Committee and Boards do their respected tasks.
4) The new rules should be made official, and mods should be appointed (members of the Committee perhaps) to see that the rules are understood and enforced by other mods and members.
If this seems a bit over kill, please keep in mind that I have an intense love for, and desire that, Animation Source shall return to it's former glory. I'm also taking Civics, currently, so yes, I modeled this after the process that the American Constitution was drawn up. I do think that this is the best way, however, orderly and framed.
Comment please!
I agree completely. I also agree with what Mighty said. The Hub may or may not be a good a idea, I can see how complicated it would get, but something MUST be done about the characters. I propose this (there are two comments) :
1) A "Committee" of responsible, respectable members as well as mods of the same criteria should be drawn up and given privileges over the future "cleansing." (This may require making certain members mods for a time being.) Certain members will be put in charge of going through characters and compiling a list of characters that must go, those that could be saved, and those that deserve to be untouched. To help cut back on opinion, a Board of members should be in charge of this, and should come up with a final list. This "Character Board" would also have the responsibility of defining the terms "Sparkle" and "unrelated," and submit this and the finished list to the entire Committee. Other members will be in charge of decided the limits and future requirements of the galleries, forming their own "Gallery Board," to again, cut back on stark opinion as much as possible. They would be required to write these new rules/requirements and submit them to the entire Committee for approval. The Committee would then give themselves time to edit/approve the changes and then construct an announcement.
A time limit should be given to the entire Committee to see that these tasks are done in a timely matter.
......
Razor
Brown --> I'd still like to have an answer to teh question of what constitutes an unrelated character. For instance, would Loki be considered unrelated? http://www.animationsource.org/balto/en/chars/Loki/35785.html He has no direct connection to Balto or the other canonical characters, but he could fairly be counted as a friend of the family, and he was quite popular until a hacker deleted his profile and I had to restore him from a copy saved by a friend.
Wolf
Come on, we can agree on that, and if we do, what is to be done with the characters on all the Sources that are sparkle or non related? We can't just keep them around. That sends a stupid message, excuse my language.
Rose
Rose
I have a lot of suggestions to deal with this problem, but I just finished typing it on the forum topic dedicated to discussing this. To summarize, I don't agree with making a new site or deleting all of the characters; unrelated stuff should be deleted, ALL of it, and it should never be allowed on again; there should be a process to delete characters that never get used; characters used just for roleplaying shuould not be allowed; and characters should have to be approved by the mods again.
Basically, I want AS characters to go back to the way they used to be! When there were no problems or complaining. When the character section was well-done and interesting. Anyone who has a problem with keeping a fansite relative to the movie needs to just.... well, to be frank, leave.
The Natural color based on a true dog : http://www.husky-petlove.com/win2_scarlredt2001.jpg
The cartoon color based on Balto movie : http://83.img.v4.skyrock.net/83c/baltoleloup/pics/2600713450_1.jpg
And the sparkle one, based on a drawing I do for Kay fedewa's character : http://fc07.deviantart.net/fs1 [...] b/Bloodspill_by_hecatehell.jpg
Then, it's easy to see the difference and there is no problem ^-^ Plus, when we are not sure if a character is too sparkle or is ok, we ask to the others mods and follow the majority to be fair.
But maybe someone should do the example of wich color is too Sparkle ? With something like the color choice on photoshop it's easy to make a separation between Sparkle and not http://files.byondhome.com/TheMonkeyDidIt/shading1_ps_color_picker.jpg
kopa
Razor
3. Mandate connection to the canon characters. Simply put, have a rule to be enforced by the mods that characters in fanart and fan fiction be somehow connected with those in the Balto movies. I won't say how closely connected because I feel that any set number of degrees of separation would be rather arbitrary, but some kinf of connection born out in any stories where the characters might appear seems reasonable. To be fair, this one might be waived for RP-only characters, or it might not. Make your opinion known on this, please.
4. Settle on some rules that compromise. Let's face it. If you ruled out all unrealistically colored characters then Jenna would have to go. So why not just agree on something like no characters with wacky markings (except on MLP Source if that opens up) or really crazy color combos like red, yellow and green? The rules could be flexible according to site, like more color versatility on ADGTH Source (or HTTYD Source since, after all, what rules are there about dragon colors?) and the aforementioned dispensation on MLP Source if that ever opens.
Any thoughts?
Razor
1. Appoint character mods. This ideas is already out there, and it's one of those that I think makes a great deal of sense. We have mods to keep teh rest of the site in line, why not the characters as well?
2. Set a limit on unused characters. This may be a bit long for those who want a fast and oversimplified solution, but stay with me here. Since characters can be registered as present in fanfics and other fan material, it stands to reason that they could be regulated much as those other works are. For example, at least 25% of every fanfic gallery must consist of stories involving canon characters. The same, unless I'm mistaken, goes for art and images. So just set up the reverse for characters; have it set up so that if someone has more than X percent or X amount of characters that aren't in any story or picture, they can't load any new characters. Since this is such a hot issue, I could see making the "used character quota" higher than that of canon-related content in other sections - say, 50 or 75%. This would have the added benefit of keeping things tied to the original characters, since in order to produce works featuring all of their own characters people would also have to do stuff with the canon characters too.
I couldn´t agree more. If unrelated (that includes sparkle characters and other strange "creatures") are banned all problems (at least the problems mentioned in this news) will most likely be solved.
If there is going to be a solution, there should only be ONE. "
Maybe there is an other that I've said before. The members who want it should be they own site or forum. It's free ( for the forum at least ) and doesn't take much time to do ( design, rules and organisation ). Then, the members who want this forum/site would chose they own mods and they'll make it together ^-^
"Next, on this hub. I've read all the comments and have seen all sides. I do agree that while I was very optimistic about this Hub, I do think that it will have an extremely low popularity. Noobs want to upload their characters and such to a fansite, not just a random stock pile. Plus, it would be extremely hard to enforce, and the Hub would end up losing members as those who don't care and just want to spam get on even their nerves. To combat this, however, and I held this view back in Mighty's little joke, we should make it somewhat appealing and less insulting by referring to it as a Hub: A Source for the fandoms that don't yet have a Source. It wouldn't be to the majority of junk that is moved there, but it could still be under that disguise."
-----------------
I've been thinking about this hub site, and I think it would be in the best interest to ditch the idea. It sounds like an awful amount of work. Not only with management, but creating it. I think it would just be easier to just ban the "not related to Balto"category, and focus on when needs to be done to get this site back on track.
If there is going to be a solution, there should only be one.
As for the character limit, I think 10 would be a acceptable limit. People are always going to whine, BUT don't let that slow you down. That's their problem. There is more to this site than making characters. If someone by chance happened to have more than 10 characters, and would like to use them, then I think the solution would be to upload the character to DA and link to it from there.
pala
But this disgusting plethora of half-done role-playing characters, sparkles and unrealistic garbage? No. Uh uh. There definitely needs to be a reinstatement of the old ban on those. Updated to take all possible issues into account. A fair limit for fan art too. But the fan fiction situation is a bit different, by its very nature.
Wolf
Wolf
tugalTCG
If I had a say, I'd just say, do away with the characters section completely. There's just no point to it anymore. If people want to be creative with characters, they can take it to other sites. Animation Source is centered around QUALITY (not quantity, despite popular belief). I remember a time when people cared about the art and fanfics and the like on these sites. Now it's almost entirely reduced to characters.
Again, just my 2c worth.
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